On the PM.

Matt
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Re: On the PM.

Post by Matt » Mon Jun 10, 2019 7:57 pm

Oh my goodness he's second favourite
https://www.oddschecker.com/politics/br ... ive-leader

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Re: On the PM.

Post by Tony.Williams » Tue Jun 11, 2019 7:37 pm

Croydon13013 wrote:
Mon Jun 10, 2019 5:21 pm

True, but I very much noticed what Chaggle did. It was all about saving the Tories not the country.
Presumably they believe that whatever is good for their party must, by definition, be good for the country.

There is of course an even more important priority for the candidates, which usually goes unspoken: saving their careers.

MPs generally have a similar priority order in choosing their new leader, with the most important criterion being "which one has the best chance of maximising the Tory vote in the next general election (long may it be deferred) and thereby preserving my nicely-paid job?" :ey

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chaggle
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Re: On the PM.

Post by chaggle » Thu Jun 13, 2019 8:29 am

Rees-Mogg on GMB saying exactly the same thing - 'If we don't leave on 31st October there won't be a Conservative party left to lead'.
Don't blame me - I voted remain :con

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Re: On the PM.

Post by Matt » Thu Jun 13, 2019 3:39 pm

And of course from his point of view, that's a bad thing.

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Re: On the PM.

Post by Tony.Williams » Sun Jun 16, 2019 8:48 pm

Now the first TV debate is over, it will be interesting to see what impact (if any) it has on the polls. My impression was that Raab did the worst (in terms of what he said and how the audience reacted to him); Hunt was probably the next worst; Javid next, then Gove - but Stewart gained more applause than the rest of them put together. How much did Johnson's absence hurt him, I wonder?

Of course, what the general public thinks of the candidates isn't what matters - it's their fellow MPs they need to impress, and It's hard to see how Stewart will gain enough extra votes even to get to the next round, let alone the last two. Johnson now seems near unbeatable as so many MPs are supporting him (although they have been known to change their minds), and senior Tories are now angling for cabinet posts..

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Re: On the PM.

Post by Tony.Williams » Tue Jun 18, 2019 9:34 am

Despite the above, BoJo, Gove and Hunt supporters are reportedly panicking about the surge behind Stewart's bid. The Telegraph is even suggesting that Stewart might have been an MI6 spy - which might backfire, as it could boost his popular status no end. He would have to deny it, of course, but if he becomes PM and his official limo changes to an Aston Martin, we will know... :thumb:

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chaggle
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Re: On the PM.

Post by chaggle » Tue Jun 18, 2019 2:36 pm

Image
Don't blame me - I voted remain :con

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Re: On the PM.

Post by Tony.Williams » Wed Jun 19, 2019 8:35 am

Well, Stewart survived the MP's vote remarkably well but then visibly lost interest during the BBC debate which was a complete shambles. I was hoping to see each candidate subjected to an expert grilling which would pin them down and not allow their usual vague statements to pass unchecked. Instead we had endless vacuous waffling and sound bites, plus lots of shouting across each other. Not Emily Maitlis's best day. FWIW, the impression I had was that Johnson and Stewart showed up worst, Hunt made no impression, while Gove was stridently proclaiming his superior credentials at every opportunity, leaving Javid as the least worst performer. A waste of an hour.

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chaggle
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Re: On the PM.

Post by chaggle » Wed Jun 19, 2019 10:41 am

My feelings are that whatever you think of their political stance, these are a pretty intelligent and talented bunch (possibly Boris excepted) that under normal circumstances could be seen as suitable to lead a major political party.

But the circumstances of the moment are far from normal - Brexit taints everything. It is poisonous.

It's going to take someone very special to see this through and none of these is special.

I don't think anyone is at the moment.
Don't blame me - I voted remain :con

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Re: On the PM.

Post by Tony.Williams » Wed Jun 19, 2019 11:04 am

chaggle wrote:
Wed Jun 19, 2019 10:41 am

It's going to take someone very special to see this through and none of these is special.

I don't think anyone is at the moment.
I agree, with both points.

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Re: On the PM.

Post by Tony.Williams » Wed Jun 19, 2019 11:49 am

The first two thoughts to strike the successful contender:

1. "Hooray, I've won! :yay

2. "Oh shit, now what...?" :???:

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chaggle
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Re: On the PM.

Post by chaggle » Wed Jun 19, 2019 4:57 pm

Croydon13013 wrote:
Mon Jun 10, 2019 5:21 pm
Matt wrote:
Mon Jun 10, 2019 4:49 pm
He's campaigning to the party. The nation doesn't get a say on who leads us out of the undemocratic EU, just the party....
True, but I very much noticed what Chaggle did. It was all about saving the Tories not the country. Hopefully floating voters will be noticing the same thing.
Looks like it's not only the Tories...

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... GMPsAF_bNc
Twenty-six Labour MPs have written to Jeremy Corbyn, warning him that embracing a second Brexit referendum would be “toxic to our bedrock voters”.
“There is an evident risk that shifting to a more explicitly pro-remain position would leave us vulnerable in seats we need to hold or win without enough potential seat gains in winnable remain majority areas.
Don't blame me - I voted remain :con

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Re: On the PM.

Post by bindeweede » Wed Jun 19, 2019 8:12 pm

So Rory Stewart eliminated. So a great big BJ looking more and more likely as PM.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... tends-lead

Matt
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Re: On the PM.

Post by Matt » Wed Jun 19, 2019 8:30 pm

I didn't watch either of the debates. Is that bad of me? Or is it reality TV with no relevance to my life?

Five people in a national debate:
In order to persuade a few hundred people who already know them well,
to let them be one of the two people I'm not allowed to vote for,
to lead the party I don't want to vote for.

Watching would simply be an exercise in emphasising my own impotence. Yet I'm told the the viewing figures were in excess of five million. Or in other words over 42 times as many people who have a hope of casting a vote for one of the participants to become leader.

Make it trial by combat and them I'll watch.

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Re: On the PM.

Post by Tony.Williams » Thu Jun 20, 2019 9:38 am

bindeweede wrote:
Wed Jun 19, 2019 8:12 pm
So Rory Stewart eliminated. So a great big BJ looking more and more likely as PM.
Well, it appears that BJ's supporters used tactical voting to get rid of Raab (hence Stewart's sudden increase in supporters, most of which vanished immediately afterwards) and they are now going to try to prevent Gove from reaching the final, partly in revenge for the notorious backstabbing and partly because they reckon Hunt will be the easiest for them to defeat in the final.

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